If you have left Gracepoint or one of their affiliated ministries recently or a while ago and need help, please reach out. Talk to a trusted friend or family member. Leave a comment on this blog. Therapy can help as well. Don't isolate yourself.
I complied the list of folks who have indicated that they are willing to be contacted. Some are very old so may not be valid anymore. If you are on this list and want to be removed, just submit a comment. If you want to be added, submit a comment.
- quentin0111 at gmail dot com (former UCI a2f attendee)
- parkys229 at gmail dot come (no longer in Gracepoint but believes Gracepoint is a God-driven church)
- r a d I a n t j u b I l e e at gmail dot come (with no spaces, left many years ago currently in Seattle)
- Jaydubya2020 at gmail dot com
- Truth dot seeker2100 at gmail dot com
- Zacherylovesthelord at gmail dot com (former UC Riverside)
- sk1nnyzebra at yahoo dot com (used to attend)
- gracepoint dot reject at gmail dot com
- danielyee517 at gmail dot com (attended Berkeley for 4-5 years, willing to help people in the Berkeley area or be added on Facebook)
- leavegracepoint at gmail dot com
- formergracepointmember at gmail dot com (was with Element and an undergrad group at Berkeley from 2014-2017. Left in 2017. Currently living in San Diego. Added on 1/12/2021)
- iyoon22 at gmail do t com (currently lives in Southern California, graduated from Berkeley in 2015, see comment below.) (added on 2/1/20201)
This is an especially hard season with COVID, decreasing daylight, and the holidays just around the corner. Take gentle care of yourself and be well.
Hi John, thank you so much for these resources. I am a college student in Southern California currently in the process of leaving, and have endured a great deal of relational difficulties, spiritual confusion, and self-doubt. I was just wondering if any of these individuals recently graduated from a SoCal school, or if anyone is located there and available for advice, mental health support, and/or spiritual support? Also, have these emails been verified to ensure protection of my identity and experiences? Thank you!
ReplyDeleteNo, these emails have not been verified. It is simply a list of folks who have offered to help via comments on this blog. I don't know if any of them are from Southern California. Sorry to hear about your hard times. Leaving Gracepoint is hard but it's worth it!
DeleteYou're welcome to reach out to us at leavegracepoint@gmail.com. Like I mentioned previously, we are in contact with a lot of former GP people who are both from/in SoCal and NorCal who will be more than willing to help you go through this process of leaving Gracepoint. Please don't hesitate! All of us have gone through this extremely difficult process and understand the struggles and are here to support you through it.
DeleteHi, I stumbled across this site fairly recently. I'm currently residing in SoCal and graduated from Berkeley in 2015. I would like to offer help. Can my email be added to the list? iyoon22@gmail.com.
DeleteHello friend, I graduated from UCSD 4 years ago, and still live in San Diego! My email is alo21792 at gmail dot com
ReplyDeleteCan you say a bit more about when you left gracepoint and about your experience?
DeleteI left around October/November 2016, although I started having misgivings about Gracepoint as early as January/February that year. Over the years, I've written several long comments on this blog and on Yelp about my experiences. Off the top of my head, they are:
Delete- The May 3, 2020 comment at the top of the recent post "Self Love and Self Compassion."
- An August 6, 2017 Yelp review on Gracepoint Berkeley
Long story short, my leader was perpetually dissatisfied and distrustful of everything that I said and did. They constantly felt that my life wasn't an "open book," that I wasn't sufficiently transparent. That there was a "hidden-ness" and a "darkness" about me. They would speculate that the reason I "refused to live an open life" was that I didn't want to admit I was a sinner, and that I was too arrogant to tell the truth about myself.
My leader also told me multiple times that if I "don't like what they have to say about me, it's because I don't want to hear the truth about myself." Gee, what an extraordinary claim! I'm living a "dark" and "hidden" life, but they claim to know the truth about me?
I'm quentino111@gmail.com
ReplyDeleteif you want to talk, feel free to shoot me an email
our conversation will remain completely confidential
caveat: I'm an apostate, gracepoint cemented that
I can offer help, I came from a SoCal school. Of course it's hard to trust a random stranger on the internet, but here's my email: johnbaxter159@gmail.com
ReplyDeleteCan you say a bit more about when you left gracepoint and about your experience?
DeleteI left recently in the 2010s. I had a good time and I am grateful for GP helping me to become Christian. But long story short, I didn't like the culture, didn't vibe well with leadership, and was accused of some things I supposedly did without a chance to defend myself. I do still have friends in GP though.
DeleteHi John, I've only commented once in this blog back when I needed help leaving Gracepoint (in 2017). Thanks for continuing to hold this blog up.
ReplyDeleteI'd love to be added to the email list and help those out who are thinking about leaving. I was with Element and one of the undergrad groups from 2014 - 2017. Feel free to email me questions. formergracepointmember @ gmail
thanks! I'll add your email.
DeleteAlso FYI I moved to San Diego, so if anyone needs someone to chat with via in person, email, etc., feel free to reach out. I would've been class of 2018.
DeleteHow did you guys deal with feelings of sadness towards close friends and people you care about that chose to stay after you explained why you left?
ReplyDeleteMy time at GP allowed me to grow close to a lot of people and I find it hard to see that they don't recognize the dangers of GP.
I'm with you there - it's hard. There's sort of two realities about my time at GP: the one where I was spiritually abused and I was living under a distorted theology, and the one in which there were real relationships, points of connection with God, and I was doing good work I was proud to be a part of. It's hard to reconcile that those realities are both true. I feel this frustration with my friends still there, where I want to shake them and be like "how are you okay with being in an organization that did this to me? And don't you see what it's done to you as well?" But I think that being too direct and forceful with that would cause them to just pull away, so I'm trying to be patient and gentle.
DeleteI do think it's important to try to maintain those relationships (if doing so isnt personally harmful/too painful). And yes, that often means offering a wiiiiide open schedule and not being too offended if they flake at the last minute because xyz important GP meeting has now come up. But one of the things that finally got me out of GP was a Christian friend who was able to offer a non-GP perspective to me. We may have the opportunity to be that voice to them.
I have GP friends that have been posting about this "opportunity" for mentorship on LinkedIn: https://www.advancementorship.org/
ReplyDeleteAt least before, it was more clear that their "opportunities" were associated with the church. With this, there's no way you could tell their affiliation with GP. Another bait and switch tactic?
We have another thread somewhere in this site talking about this. They also have Bay Area Mentors and International Student Mentorship Program (ISMP) doing the same thing. And so far, from what I heard from my source that signed up for kicks, it's a scam. So at this point it is confirmed to be a bait and switch. I've also compiled a list of all of their related 100+ groups/igs that I'm still in the process of organizing and will get John to post once I'm done.
DeleteI get that it's a bait-and-switch scheme, but what makes you say it's a scam? Maybe they offer valuable career guidance while probing for opportunities to recruit into gp.
DeleteIsn't that what a scam is? You trick someone by offering one thing, but you have a hidden motivation or purpose.
DeleteI'm guessing you're saying that it's not a scam because they offer what they advertise (they actually do offer career advice)? I suppose that's true.
But still, I think if I was a student looking for career advice and went somewhere advertising they were giving career advice, I would feel extremely duped and misled if I found out they were all really from the same church and their real motivation was to get me to join their church. Even if they gave me good career advice along the way, I would feel "scammed" because they weren't upfront about who the were and what their motivations were.
Also I don't know if you noticed, a lot of their LinkedIn posts show that lots of people are commenting and liking the post. It's actually other members of their church pumping and commenting just so the algorithm gives them more visibility. Not sure what else you need to know about this bait and switch mentorship scam that they have concocted.
DeleteThat certainly seems expected; previous posts on this blog dating back 10+ years discuss how GP artificially inflates traffic to their content on the internet. I wouldn't be too concerned if it's mostly naive students who are likely unaware of GP's true motivation that are reacting to and commenting on the posts, but if it's staff then that would be much more suspicious.
DeleteSome of the yelp reviews are by staff too.
Deletehttps://www.instagram.com/salesforce.berkeley/
DeleteWow they've taken it next level and decided to use Salesforce now. It's suspect enough that Salesforce would do a recruiting event at Durant Loft.
Has anyone maybe looked into setting up an unofficial subreddit specifically for GP? There's a lot of different thoughts and material in the comments here - it may be easier to have it in the style of a forum, like a successor to Gracepoint is Dangerous (a forum run by an ex-berklander until he/she decided not to maintain it anymore)
ReplyDeleteYou are welcome to create one and I'd be happy to link to it here.
DeleteI think that's a great idea. I just started one here: reddit.com/r/GracepointChurch/
DeleteI will fill it out more in the coming days.
It's actually one of the ideas I had but obviously if you look at Reddit, it's more of a question regarding that church per campus. Like you, I am interested in starting one, so if you want to talk more, email me at leavegracepoint [at] gmail.
DeleteSubscribed to the subreddit!
DeleteWhile the questions may be targeted towards specific campuses, I think it is safe to say that all GP churches run on the same formula, maybe some minor nuances that vary here and there, but from my knowledge of GP, every church plant is 99.9% identical in terms of their culture.
DeleteI'm personally not sure how effective/convenient the subreddit would be (mainly bc the blog acts more of like a discussion while reddit functions with individual posts and topics)
Deletebut I definitely think it's an additional pathway for students wary of GP to seek information.
I think a great first reddit post would be to link the blogspot + yelp reviews of various GP campuses for students looking for more info. about GP.
@Leave Gracepoint
DeleteI just set a subreddit up. If you want to be a mod on it let me know your reddit username and I will add you as a mod. I just wanted to get the sub registered before GP members started registering and squatting on a bunch of subreddit names.
Whoever is moderating the subreddit needs to update their information. GP is currently lists on their website at least at 25+ campuses not 19. I also got more leaks of their other target schools and church plant location that I can post later when I organize all of the information.
DeleteHi John,
ReplyDeleteThank you very much for this blog. My sister is currently living in Alameda and she has been involved with Gracepoint for years. I know for a fact that her extreme devotion to the church only points to one thing - cult. She has no friends outside of her church and she has had strained relationships with us since she has been involved in the church. It really doesn't take a genius to know that something is off. I don't know what is happening inside the church, but I am very concerned for her. Any suggestions? Can I email you?
Thanks
Hi Ann, There are many suggestions on this blog, both in the posts and comments so I invite you to read. I'm sorry about your sister. There are folks who have offered to help and their email addresses are posted here. You are welcome to comment with any questions you have specifically for me but I don't give out my email to protect my safety.
DeleteMy general sense from reading through this page is that gracepoint / berkland / koinonia / etc. is still a mainstream Christian Church, that has a lot of problems and people are discussing it in that way. Maybe it hurt some people, but we come to this page to vent, try to help others cope, maybe even in a long shot hope we can make meaningful change from the outside to fix the problems. In a larger sense, maybe the Southern Baptist Convention is also a mainstream Christian church with some issues. And we can all just dismiss it by saying that churches are made of imperfect humans (an excuse I now roll my eyes at). Maybe Pastor Ed and Becky had good intentions and went astray somewhere or made mistakes.
ReplyDeleteBut at some point, do we have to start calling it a cult? Because this is what cults historically have done to their members to control their behavior, information, thoughts and emotions (bite model).
There's too many examples to go through now, but anyone who has been to Gracepoint tell me you've never felt this way or been in a similar situation
Jehovah's Witnesses Shun members who leave and/or turn against the elders, essentially making them outcasts. Family and friends cutting you off. Shaming them for any sexual feelings, even having a crush on the opposite gender in school. That's not even getting into stuff about homosexuals, that's just how they treat heterosexual people.
Mormon's controlling information flow to their members to the point they believe in things like God living on another planet with a specific name (I don't know the name). Pressuring them to go on mission trips. Forcing them to always seem cheerful and happy so that outsiders will want to join them.
Both of these groups are insular, doing business only with other Mormon's or Jehovah's witnesses, intermarrying within the group to keep people insulated from the outside world, to the point that members are terrified of leaving because all they've known is within the walls of the group.
They make them feel special, like they're the chosen people with access to a secret knowledge that outsiders don't understand.
Arguably not a cult, but you could possibly persuade me, the Catholic church having a whole system to manage information so that outsiders have no idea about child abuse going on within. And other secret stuff.
Does any of this sound analogous to anything Gracepoint does? Or am I totally off base and this is all just normal behavior of any healthy Christian group?
I'll probably make a longer post if I ever get around to it.
But if they're a cult, doesn't that change the whole conversation we should be having? It's not just venting and complaining about personal experiences anymore. It's not just about individual stories here and there. It's discussing a dangerous organization that is actively hurting people and will continue to hurt people, and maybe, however unlikely, stopping them from doing it even more. Or maybe it was that anyway, but at least the label of a cult clarifies things.
I'm sticking my neck out, but I'm putting my email here. I'm not calling them a cult, I'm just asking. That question mark is so useful.
jaydubya2020@gmail.com
Valid points. If it quacks like a duck, looks like a duck, swims like a duck, when can you actually call it a duck?
DeleteI'm a former berklander. I left like 8 years ago. I never realized, but it does actually share a lot of characteristics of a cult.
DeleteI attended Berkland long time ago. It saddens me whenever I visit this page that all these are still going on. Recently, I had been taking some courses and felt absolutely amazed by the Gospel. The Gospel is not a performance-based religion. The core of Christianity is that God affectionately loves you, a believer, in the same way as He loves Jesus. He delights in you just as you are. You are in union with Christ and he loves you. You are worth a son to God. Each person is worth a son to God. The Holy Spirit dwells in you and the Holy Spirit is your partner wherever you go. The main point of Christianity is to enjoy these truth and to dwell on these everyday. The good work that followed are by products of us feeling amazed by His love. It's not healthy to do work because of shame and guilt. It's also not good to motivate people using shame and guilt because that is not love. Doing good work is not the focus of the Gospel. When doing good work becomes the focus, we are enslaved by the law. Christ had abolished them for a reason because we will always fail if we live by the law. The Trinitarian family is different from the church family. The latter will disappoint but it is the former that will be the rock and we will always be loved just as we are. If anyone is interested, below are the classes I have been taking. I have been going to healthy churches since leaving Berkland but even so taking these classes have been refreshing to me this year. There are also some free videos I recommend. They address the legalistic, performance based issues with churches and also cultural or family background that can affect a person experiencing the Gospel. May everyone be able to experience God's love for what it truly is. Take care.
ReplyDeleteFree videos when register:
https://www.head2heart.org/seminars
Couple of my favorites:
https://www.bwgiheadtoheart.com/courses/the-trinity/340357-default-section/969099-the-trinity
https://www.bwgiheadtoheart.com/courses/bwgi-seminar-love
Paid courses but you can apply for scholarship:
https://www.whatgodintended.org/courses
Best,
Grace
I also want to add for the students in Gracepoint, as mentioned in the Sermons of the Mount, Matt 7:6, there are situations and relationships in life you want to leave. If you aren't experiencing the fruit of the spirits most of the time, if the church is not teaching you how to face suffering and pain in life that can lead to true peace, if you aren't able to share freely with some people in church and feel loved but you only feel condemnation, the problem is not you. For your mental health protection, you would want to make an environment change and "give your pearl" to a healthy environment instead.
ReplyDeleteGrace